transliterating Graeco-Latin: Difference between revisions
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The following sound correspondences were used by [[User:James Cooke Brown|JCB]] in Loglan 1 (Brown, J.C. 1989. ''Loglan 1.'' 4th ed. Gainsville (FL.): [[The Loglan Institute|The Loglan Institute]].) pp. 438-439, to map Linnaean names to [[jbocre: Loglan|Loglan]]; I think they are sound for Lojban, but am interested in opinions. | |||
Note that these rules concern Linnaean names, which include words from far and wide; they are not restricted to Graeco-Latin. | |||
''Note that I rewrote these rules already in The Book, section 4.8. (JWC)'' | |||
I | Aaaargh. I retract everything and anything then. The Book rules are binding, as far as I'm concerned. -- mi'e [[User:Nick Nicholas|nitcion]]. | ||
;aa:''a''. aardvark => ''ardvark'' | |||
;ae:ai-or-ae => ''e''. aegyptopithecus => ''egiptopithekus'' | |||
;c:c before C/a/o/u => ''k''; c followed by e/i/y, or matched in the symbol of an element word, unchanged. canid => ''kanid''; but violoncello => ''violoncelo'' and californium => ''californium'' | |||
;cc:cc followed by e/i/y => ''kc''; otherwise cc => ''k''. succinta => ''sukcinta'', but Echinococcus => ''ekinokokus''. | |||
* How about cc followed by e/i/y => ''tc''? ''--mi'e [[User:tsali|tsali]]'' | |||
;CC:Any double instance of a C not c is replaced by a single instance of that C. Bettongia => ''betongia'' | |||
;ch:''k''. Escherichia => ''eskerikia'' | |||
* Here, I think there is a case for Lojban 'x' instead. | |||
* If this is German, which is what it looks like, it should be, it should be ecerixia. Similarly Eschscholtzia -=> ecoltsia (California poppy; the name is �schholz transliterated into Russian and back). -- phma | |||
*In the interest of common sense, I'm prepared to go along with this: if the name is not Latin, native pronunciation should be emulated --- mi'e [[User:Nick Nicholas|nitcion]]. | |||
;ee:''i''. sakeen => ''sakin'' | |||
;eigh:''ei''. leightoni => ''leitoni'' | |||
;ew:''u''. Andrewsarchus => ''andrusarkus'' | |||
;h:h in VhC => VCh to make it pronounceable. ahli => ''alhi'' | |||
*In Lojban, I'd just drop it. | |||
;ie:''i''; non final ''ie'' unchanged. calorie => ''calori'' | |||
*Error for ''kalori'', of course | |||
;igh:''ai''. lightfooti => ''laitfuti'' | |||
;ii:''i''; non final ''ie'' unchanged. livingstonii => ''livinstoni'' | |||
;lh:lh- => ''elh''; non-initial lhC => lC; non-initial lhV unchanged. lhoesti => ''elhoesti'' | |||
*I'd just drop the h in Lojban. | |||
;ng:ngC => nC; ngV unchanged. livingstonii => ''livinstoni'', but Bettongia => ''betongia''. [[jbocre: Loglan-specific word breaking apart rules omitted.|Loglan-specific word breaking apart rules omitted.]] | |||
;oo:''u''; except in 'zoo-' and other disyllables in which oo remains unchanged. lightfooti => ''laitfuti'', but Zoothera => ''zoothera'' | |||
*The diphthongal oo is of course Greek, not Latin (omega + omicron) | |||
;ou:''u'' when within a natural form: youngi => ''iungi''; when split between two forms, unchanged: thiourea = thio + urea => ''tiourea'' | |||
;ow:''ao'': owstoni => aostoni | |||
* In Lojban, this becomes ''au''. | |||
;ph:''f''; ph- => ''eph'' in very short words; non-initial ph unchanged when it will give an otherwise breaking word. phenyl => ''fenil'', but phyla => ''ephila''; and ophiocomina => ''ophiokomina'' | |||
* None of this need detain us; blanket ph => ''f'' is fine. | |||
;pt:''ept''; non initial pt remains unchanged. Pterocera => epterocera. | |||
* I see no reason for this in Lojban. | |||
;pn:''n''; non-initial pn remains unchanged. pneumonia => ''neumonia''. | |||
* I see no reason for this either. | |||
;q:''k''. antiquitas => ''antikuitas''. | |||
;qu:in Spanish source words quV => kV; but in a Linnaean, quV => kuV. braquiopodo => ''brakiopodo''; but Madoqua => ''madokua'' | |||
* Spanish was JCB's preferred source language. | |||
;rh:''r''; rhC => rC; non-initial rhV unchanged. rhodopsin => ''rodopsin'' | |||
;sc:''sk''. sclerosis => ''sklerosis''. | |||
;th:when not followed by a stressed V, th => ''t''; when followed by V', h is retained. Also, if the th-containing word is related to one in which h preceded V', keep the h. Thus ethylene ''ethileni'' [[jbocre: et-hee-LEH-nee|et-hee-LEH-nee]] is related to ethyl ''ethili'' [[jbocre: et-HEE-lee|et-HEE-lee]] and so keeps its h. | |||
*Lojban can just reduce it to ''t'' in all cases. | |||
;y:''i''. Amphyosemian => ''amfiosemian'' | |||
;yn:''un'' whenever the n is the last C in the word. butenyne => ''butenune'', but dynamo => ''dinamo'' | |||
*I have no idea where this is coming from. | |||
;x:x- => ''z'' unless matched in the symbol of an element word, when unchanged; when non-initial, => ''ks''. xenyl => ''zenil'', but Atilax => ''atilaks''; xenon unchanged. | |||
;w:''u'' unless matched in the symbol of an element word, e.g., ''lawrencium'' | |||
*Untenable in Lojban | |||
;j:Not rewritten; it is retained and pronounced as Loglan [[jbocre: zh|zh]]. |
Revision as of 17:18, 4 November 2013
The following sound correspondences were used by JCB in Loglan 1 (Brown, J.C. 1989. Loglan 1. 4th ed. Gainsville (FL.): The Loglan Institute.) pp. 438-439, to map Linnaean names to Loglan; I think they are sound for Lojban, but am interested in opinions.
Note that these rules concern Linnaean names, which include words from far and wide; they are not restricted to Graeco-Latin.
Note that I rewrote these rules already in The Book, section 4.8. (JWC)
Aaaargh. I retract everything and anything then. The Book rules are binding, as far as I'm concerned. -- mi'e nitcion.
- aa
- a. aardvark => ardvark
- ae
- ai-or-ae => e. aegyptopithecus => egiptopithekus
- c
- c before C/a/o/u => k; c followed by e/i/y, or matched in the symbol of an element word, unchanged. canid => kanid; but violoncello => violoncelo and californium => californium
- cc
- cc followed by e/i/y => kc; otherwise cc => k. succinta => sukcinta, but Echinococcus => ekinokokus.
- How about cc followed by e/i/y => tc? --mi'e tsali
- CC
- Any double instance of a C not c is replaced by a single instance of that C. Bettongia => betongia
- ch
- k. Escherichia => eskerikia
- Here, I think there is a case for Lojban 'x' instead.
- If this is German, which is what it looks like, it should be, it should be ecerixia. Similarly Eschscholtzia -=> ecoltsia (California poppy; the name is �schholz transliterated into Russian and back). -- phma
- In the interest of common sense, I'm prepared to go along with this: if the name is not Latin, native pronunciation should be emulated --- mi'e nitcion.
- ee
- i. sakeen => sakin
- eigh
- ei. leightoni => leitoni
- ew
- u. Andrewsarchus => andrusarkus
- h
- h in VhC => VCh to make it pronounceable. ahli => alhi
- In Lojban, I'd just drop it.
- ie
- i; non final ie unchanged. calorie => calori
- Error for kalori, of course
- igh
- ai. lightfooti => laitfuti
- ii
- i; non final ie unchanged. livingstonii => livinstoni
- lh
- lh- => elh; non-initial lhC => lC; non-initial lhV unchanged. lhoesti => elhoesti
- I'd just drop the h in Lojban.
- ng
- ngC => nC; ngV unchanged. livingstonii => livinstoni, but Bettongia => betongia. Loglan-specific word breaking apart rules omitted.
- oo
- u; except in 'zoo-' and other disyllables in which oo remains unchanged. lightfooti => laitfuti, but Zoothera => zoothera
- The diphthongal oo is of course Greek, not Latin (omega + omicron)
- ou
- u when within a natural form: youngi => iungi; when split between two forms, unchanged: thiourea = thio + urea => tiourea
- ow
- ao: owstoni => aostoni
- In Lojban, this becomes au.
- ph
- f; ph- => eph in very short words; non-initial ph unchanged when it will give an otherwise breaking word. phenyl => fenil, but phyla => ephila; and ophiocomina => ophiokomina
- None of this need detain us; blanket ph => f is fine.
- pt
- ept; non initial pt remains unchanged. Pterocera => epterocera.
- I see no reason for this in Lojban.
- pn
- n; non-initial pn remains unchanged. pneumonia => neumonia.
- I see no reason for this either.
- q
- k. antiquitas => antikuitas.
- qu
- in Spanish source words quV => kV; but in a Linnaean, quV => kuV. braquiopodo => brakiopodo; but Madoqua => madokua
- Spanish was JCB's preferred source language.
- rh
- r; rhC => rC; non-initial rhV unchanged. rhodopsin => rodopsin
- sc
- sk. sclerosis => sklerosis.
- th
- when not followed by a stressed V, th => t; when followed by V', h is retained. Also, if the th-containing word is related to one in which h preceded V', keep the h. Thus ethylene ethileni et-hee-LEH-nee is related to ethyl ethili et-HEE-lee and so keeps its h.
- Lojban can just reduce it to t in all cases.
- y
- i. Amphyosemian => amfiosemian
- yn
- un whenever the n is the last C in the word. butenyne => butenune, but dynamo => dinamo
- I have no idea where this is coming from.
- x
- x- => z unless matched in the symbol of an element word, when unchanged; when non-initial, => ks. xenyl => zenil, but Atilax => atilaks; xenon unchanged.
- w
- u unless matched in the symbol of an element word, e.g., lawrencium
- Untenable in Lojban
- j
- Not rewritten; it is retained and pronounced as Loglan zh.