possessive sumti: Difference between revisions
(Gleki moved page jbocre: Lojban timeline to Lojban timeline) |
(Created page with "The pattern {lo SUMTI SELBRI [ku]} is quite useful, but can also cause confusion for nintadni, especially when they first encounter it e.g. on IRC. I (no'u la durka) asserted...") |
||
Line 1: | Line 1: | ||
The pattern {lo SUMTI SELBRI [ku]} is quite useful, but can also cause confusion for nintadni, especially when they first encounter it e.g. on IRC. I (no'u la durka) asserted that it isn't so hard to explain, and others (no'u la gleki) challenged me to prove it. So here we are. | |||
(Note: I will use {lo} throughout. This also applies to {le}, but not {li} or {la}.) | |||
The simplest sumti construction is {lo SELBRI [ku]}, for example, {lo pendo} = "the friend". (The terminator {ku} may or may not be needed, depending on what comes next in the sentence.) This you should know already, if you're reading this page. | |||
[https://xkcd.com/365/ If you'll bear with me for a moment], a simple bridi might be something like {mi pendo do} = "I am your friend". This you should also know already. | |||
Now for the confusing bit. What can the bridi {lo mi pendo cu banli} possibly mean? Or even {lo mi pendo do tavla}?? It looks like I've stuffed a bridi into a sumti, and that can't possibly be grammatical! But it is, as soon as you recognize the {lo SUMTI SELBRI [ku]} pattern. | |||
What we have here is {lo mi pendo}, where {mi} is the sumti and {pendo} is the selbri. The pattern is just a shortcut for {lo SELBRI pe SUMTI}. This translation is mechanical. When you find {lo SUMTI SELBRI [ku]}, you can always expand it to {lo SELBRI pe SUMTI}. | |||
But what does it mean? The semantics are posession: | |||
pe GOI | |||
restrictive relative phrase marker: which is associated with ...; | |||
loosest associative/possessive. | |||
So, {lo mi pendo} expands to {lo pendo pe mi}, which means "the friend which is associated with me", or more commonly "my friend". | |||
Armed with this we can easily translate the first sentence {lo mi pendo cu banli} = {lo pendo pe mi cu banli} = "My friend is great". Translating the second sentence {lo mi pendo do tavla} is left as an exercise for the reader. (Hint: use an automatic parser if you are still confused.) |
Revision as of 05:03, 9 April 2014
The pattern {lo SUMTI SELBRI [ku]} is quite useful, but can also cause confusion for nintadni, especially when they first encounter it e.g. on IRC. I (no'u la durka) asserted that it isn't so hard to explain, and others (no'u la gleki) challenged me to prove it. So here we are.
(Note: I will use {lo} throughout. This also applies to {le}, but not {li} or {la}.)
The simplest sumti construction is {lo SELBRI [ku]}, for example, {lo pendo} = "the friend". (The terminator {ku} may or may not be needed, depending on what comes next in the sentence.) This you should know already, if you're reading this page.
If you'll bear with me for a moment, a simple bridi might be something like {mi pendo do} = "I am your friend". This you should also know already.
Now for the confusing bit. What can the bridi {lo mi pendo cu banli} possibly mean? Or even {lo mi pendo do tavla}?? It looks like I've stuffed a bridi into a sumti, and that can't possibly be grammatical! But it is, as soon as you recognize the {lo SUMTI SELBRI [ku]} pattern.
What we have here is {lo mi pendo}, where {mi} is the sumti and {pendo} is the selbri. The pattern is just a shortcut for {lo SELBRI pe SUMTI}. This translation is mechanical. When you find {lo SUMTI SELBRI [ku]}, you can always expand it to {lo SELBRI pe SUMTI}.
But what does it mean? The semantics are posession:
pe GOI restrictive relative phrase marker: which is associated with ...; loosest associative/possessive.
So, {lo mi pendo} expands to {lo pendo pe mi}, which means "the friend which is associated with me", or more commonly "my friend".
Armed with this we can easily translate the first sentence {lo mi pendo cu banli} = {lo pendo pe mi cu banli} = "My friend is great". Translating the second sentence {lo mi pendo do tavla} is left as an exercise for the reader. (Hint: use an automatic parser if you are still confused.)