https://mw-live.lojban.org/index.php?title=a_lot_of_water&feed=atom&action=historya lot of water - Revision history2024-03-28T14:14:53ZRevision history for this page on the wikiMediaWiki 1.38.4https://mw-live.lojban.org/index.php?title=a_lot_of_water&diff=106633&oldid=prevGleki at 06:18, 19 August 20142014-08-19T06:18:43Z<p></p>
<table style="background-color: #fff; color: #202122;" data-mw="interface">
<col class="diff-marker" />
<col class="diff-content" />
<col class="diff-marker" />
<col class="diff-content" />
<tr class="diff-title" lang="en">
<td colspan="2" style="background-color: #fff; color: #202122; text-align: center;">← Older revision</td>
<td colspan="2" style="background-color: #fff; color: #202122; text-align: center;">Revision as of 06:18, 19 August 2014</td>
</tr><tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno" id="mw-diff-left-l1">Line 1:</td>
<td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno">Line 1:</td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-side-deleted"></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">{{jbocre/en}}</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* [[User:And Rosta|And Rosta]]:</div></td><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* [[User:And Rosta|And Rosta]]:</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>** '''so'i prenu''' = '''many people'''</div></td><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>** '''so'i prenu''' = '''many people'''</div></td></tr>
<!-- diff cache key mediawiki:diff::1.12:old-106632:rev-106633 -->
</table>Glekihttps://mw-live.lojban.org/index.php?title=a_lot_of_water&diff=106632&oldid=prevGleki at 06:18, 19 August 20142014-08-19T06:18:12Z<p></p>
<table style="background-color: #fff; color: #202122;" data-mw="interface">
<col class="diff-marker" />
<col class="diff-content" />
<col class="diff-marker" />
<col class="diff-content" />
<tr class="diff-title" lang="en">
<td colspan="2" style="background-color: #fff; color: #202122; text-align: center;">← Older revision</td>
<td colspan="2" style="background-color: #fff; color: #202122; text-align: center;">Revision as of 06:18, 19 August 2014</td>
</tr><tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno" id="mw-diff-left-l1">Line 1:</td>
<td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno">Line 1:</td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* [[User:And Rosta|And Rosta]]:</div></td><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* [[User:And Rosta|And Rosta]]:</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>** '''so'i prenu''' = ''many people''</div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>** '''so'i prenu''' = <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>''many people<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>''</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>** '''pi so'i prenu''' = ''a lot of a person''</div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>** '''pi so'i prenu''' = <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>''a lot of a person<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>''</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>** '''so'i djacu''' = ''many amounts of water''</div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>** '''so'i djacu''' = <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>''many amounts of water<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>''</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>** '''pi so'i djacu''' = ''a lot of an amount of water''</div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>** '''pi so'i djacu''' = <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>''a lot of an amount of water<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>''</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>** ??? = ''a lot of water, too much water''</div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>** ??? = <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>''a lot of water, too much water''<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div> </div></td><td colspan="2" class="diff-side-added"></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* [[User:xorxes|xorxes:]]</div></td><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* [[User:xorxes|xorxes:]]</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>** '''lu'o so'i djacu or piso'i loi djacu''', they both have the same sense.</div></td><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>** '''lu'o so'i djacu or piso'i loi djacu''', they both have the same sense.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno" id="mw-diff-left-l11">Line 11:</td>
<td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno">Line 10:</td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>*** I may be missing something here, but neither of these seem right. If each amount of water is small then '''lu'o so'i djacu''' does not necessarily give you a lot of water: many waters do not necessarily amount to much water. And to me, '''pi so'i loi djacu''' implies a large proportion of the mass of all water, whereas "much water" means "a quantity that is large relative to the quantity that is normal".</div></td><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>*** I may be missing something here, but neither of these seem right. If each amount of water is small then '''lu'o so'i djacu''' does not necessarily give you a lot of water: many waters do not necessarily amount to much water. And to me, '''pi so'i loi djacu''' implies a large proportion of the mass of all water, whereas "much water" means "a quantity that is large relative to the quantity that is normal".</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>*** [[User:xorxes|xorxes:]]</div></td><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>*** [[User:xorxes|xorxes:]]</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>**** I think they both mean "many amounts together". I don't think ''piso'i loi djacu'' is necessarily a large proportion of the mass of all water, because unlike ''so'a'' and ''so'e'', ''so'i'' doesn't refer to the total. Do many people make a lot of people? Only in that sense can we say that many waters make a lot of water. In any case it is subjective. Too much water would be ''pidu'e loi djacu'' or ''lu'o du'e djacu'', too many quantities of water together. All that ''djacu'' talks about is quantities of water, there is no way to describe those quantities with quantifiers, the only way of describing them is by modifying ''djacu'' with other brivla, as in ''lo djacu poi barda''.</div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>**** I think they both mean "many amounts together". I don't think <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>''piso'i loi djacu<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>'' is necessarily a large proportion of the mass of all water, because unlike <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>''so'a<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>'' and <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>''so'e<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>'', <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>''so'i<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>'' doesn't refer to the total. Do many people make a lot of people? Only in that sense can we say that many waters make a lot of water. In any case it is subjective. Too much water would be <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>''pidu'e loi djacu<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>'' or <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>''lu'o du'e djacu<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>'', too many quantities of water together. All that <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>''djacu<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>'' talks about is quantities of water, there is no way to describe those quantities with quantifiers, the only way of describing them is by modifying <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>''djacu<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>'' with other brivla, as in <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>''lo djacu poi barda<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>''.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>***** I agree that ''lu'o so'i'' means "many amounts together".</div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>***** I agree that <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>''lu'o so'i<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>'' means "many amounts together".</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>***** ''so'e'' doesn't mean "a large proportion of"; it means "most", which, to oversimplify, means "more than half of". At any rate, we do want to distinguish between "a large amount of" and "a large proportion of", and I still feel that ''pi so'i'' is a better candidate for the latter.</div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>***** <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>''so'e<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>'' doesn't mean "a large proportion of"; it means "most", which, to oversimplify, means "more than half of". At any rate, we do want to distinguish between "a large amount of" and "a large proportion of", and I still feel that <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>''pi so'i<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>'' is a better candidate for the latter.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>***** I guess it makes sense to separate the two meanings.</div></td><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>***** I guess it makes sense to separate the two meanings.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>***** Many people do make a lot of people, because the unit for measuring quantity of people is the single person. But since the quantity that constitutes pa djacu is undefined, the single amount of water cannot be the unit for measuring quantity of water, so many amounts of water do not necessarily make a lot of water.</div></td><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>***** Many people do make a lot of people, because the unit for measuring quantity of people is the single person. But since the quantity that constitutes pa djacu is undefined, the single amount of water cannot be the unit for measuring quantity of water, so many amounts of water do not necessarily make a lot of water.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>***** Not in an absolute sense, but in the context of those quantities, I think they do.</div></td><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>***** Not in an absolute sense, but in the context of those quantities, I think they do.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>****** Okay, yes. In a context when we are measuring quantity be amounts of water, then yes, many amounts do equal much water. But basically I stand by what I said before.</div></td><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>****** Okay, yes. In a context when we are measuring quantity be amounts of water, then yes, many amounts do equal much water. But basically I stand by what I said before.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>***** I think ''pidu'e loi djacu'' means "too large a proportion of". I agree about the meaning of ''lu'o du'e djacu''.</div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>***** I think <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>''pidu'e loi djacu<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>'' means "too large a proportion of". I agree about the meaning of <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>''lu'o du'e djacu<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>''.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>***** You may be right that "a lot of water, much water" cannot adequately be rendered using quantifiers, but if this is the case it is important to know, because it is being suggested that ''PA [[va'e|va'e]]'' and ''JAhA xi PA'' could be used to render "very" (etc. -- see [[JAhA + CAI|JAhA + CAI]]), in which case the PA should be a word meaning "much". If there is no quantifier meaning "much", then none of those solutions are going to work.</div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>***** You may be right that "a lot of water, much water" cannot adequately be rendered using quantifiers, but if this is the case it is important to know, because it is being suggested that <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>''PA [[va'e|va'e]]<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>'' and <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>''JAhA xi PA<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>'' could be used to render "very" (etc. -- see [[JAhA + CAI|JAhA + CAI]]), in which case the PA should be a word meaning "much". If there is no quantifier meaning "much", then none of those solutions are going to work.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>***** [[User:xorxes|xorxes:]]</div></td><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>***** [[User:xorxes|xorxes:]]</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>****** If ''pirova'e'' means "totally", why can't the other fractions mean "very much", "a little", etc?</div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>****** If <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>''pirova'e<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>'' means "totally", why can't the other fractions mean "very much", "a little", etc?</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>******* [[User:And Rosta|And Rosta:]]</div></td><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>******* [[User:And Rosta|And Rosta:]]</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>******** Because: </div></td><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>******** Because: </div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>********* (i) "totally" <u>is</u> a proportion: ''pi ro'' = "the whole of", ''pi so'i'' = "a large proportion of". </div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>********* (i) "totally" <u>is</u> a proportion: <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>''pi ro<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>'' = "the whole of", <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>''pi so'i<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>'' = "a large proportion of". </div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>********* (ii) Applied to the scale of truth, I'd see ''pi PA'' as expressing points on the doubly-bounded scale of Sort-of between True and False. So ''pi so'i va'e'' would mean something like "pretty truish, sort-of but close to being outright true".</div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>********* (ii) Applied to the scale of truth, I'd see <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>''pi PA<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>'' as expressing points on the doubly-bounded scale of Sort-of between True and False. So <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>''pi so'i va'e<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>'' would mean something like "pretty truish, sort-of but close to being outright true".</div></td></tr>
<!-- diff cache key mediawiki:diff::1.12:old-106631:rev-106632 -->
</table>Glekihttps://mw-live.lojban.org/index.php?title=a_lot_of_water&diff=106631&oldid=prevGleki at 06:16, 19 August 20142014-08-19T06:16:42Z<p></p>
<table style="background-color: #fff; color: #202122;" data-mw="interface">
<col class="diff-marker" />
<col class="diff-content" />
<col class="diff-marker" />
<col class="diff-content" />
<tr class="diff-title" lang="en">
<td colspan="2" style="background-color: #fff; color: #202122; text-align: center;">← Older revision</td>
<td colspan="2" style="background-color: #fff; color: #202122; text-align: center;">Revision as of 06:16, 19 August 2014</td>
</tr><tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno" id="mw-diff-left-l5">Line 5:</td>
<td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno">Line 5:</td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>** '''pi so'i djacu''' = ''a lot of an amount of water''</div></td><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>** '''pi so'i djacu''' = ''a lot of an amount of water''</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>** ??? = ''a lot of water, too much water''</div></td><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>** ??? = ''a lot of water, too much water''</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">----</del></div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div> </div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* [[User:xorxes|xorxes:]]</div></td><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* [[User:xorxes|xorxes:]]</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>** '''lu'o so'i djacu or piso'i loi djacu''', they both have the same sense.</div></td><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>** '''lu'o so'i djacu or piso'i loi djacu''', they both have the same sense.</div></td></tr>
<!-- diff cache key mediawiki:diff::1.12:old-106630:rev-106631 -->
</table>Glekihttps://mw-live.lojban.org/index.php?title=a_lot_of_water&diff=106630&oldid=prevGleki at 06:16, 19 August 20142014-08-19T06:16:06Z<p></p>
<table style="background-color: #fff; color: #202122;" data-mw="interface">
<col class="diff-marker" />
<col class="diff-content" />
<col class="diff-marker" />
<col class="diff-content" />
<tr class="diff-title" lang="en">
<td colspan="2" style="background-color: #fff; color: #202122; text-align: center;">← Older revision</td>
<td colspan="2" style="background-color: #fff; color: #202122; text-align: center;">Revision as of 06:16, 19 August 2014</td>
</tr><tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno" id="mw-diff-left-l1">Line 1:</td>
<td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno">Line 1:</td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div> </div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">* [[User:And Rosta|And Rosta]]:</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">{</del>so'i prenu<del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">} </del>= <del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">"</del>many people<del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">"</del></div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">** '''</ins>so'i prenu<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">''' </ins>= <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">''</ins>many people<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">''</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">{</del>pi so'i prenu<del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">} </del>= <del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">"</del>a lot of a person<del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">"</del></div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">** '''</ins>pi so'i prenu<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">''' </ins>= <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">''</ins>a lot of a person<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">''</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">{</del>so'i djacu<del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">} </del>= <del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">"</del>many amounts of water<del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">"</del></div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">** '''</ins>so'i djacu<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">''' </ins>= <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">''</ins>many amounts of water<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">''</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">{</del>pi so'i djacu<del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">} </del>= <del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">"</del>a lot of an amount of water<del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">"</del></div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">** '''</ins>pi so'i djacu<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">''' </ins>= <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">''</ins>a lot of an amount of water<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">''</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>??? = <del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">"</del>a lot of water, too much water<del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">"</del></div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">** </ins>??? = <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">''</ins>a lot of water, too much water<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">''</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">--[[User:And Rosta|And Rosta]]</del></div></td><td colspan="2" class="diff-side-added"></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>----</div></td><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>----</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>''lu'o so'i djacu<del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'' </del>or <del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">''</del>piso'i loi djacu'', they both have the same sense. <del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">--</del>[[User:<del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">xorxes</del>|<del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">xorxes</del>]]</div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">* [[User:xorxes|xorxes:]]</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>I may be missing something here, but neither of these seem right. If each amount of water is small then ''lu'o so'i djacu'' does not necessarily give you a lot of water: many waters do not necessarily amount to much water. And to me, ''pi so'i loi djacu'' implies a large proportion of the mass of all water, whereas "much water" means "a quantity that is large relative to the quantity that is normal". <del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">--</del>[[User:<del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">And Rosta</del>|<del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">And Rosta</del>]]</div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">** '</ins>''lu'o so'i djacu or piso'i loi djacu<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>'', they both have the same sense.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>I think they both mean "many amounts together". I don't think ''piso'i loi djacu'' is necessarily a large proportion of the mass of all water, because unlike ''so'a'' and ''so'e'', ''so'i'' doesn't refer to the total. Do many people make a lot of people? Only in that sense can we say that many waters make a lot of water. In any case it is subjective. Too much water would be ''pidu'e loi djacu'' or ''lu'o du'e djacu'', too many quantities of water together. All that ''djacu'' talks about is quantities of water, there is no way to describe those quantities with quantifiers, the only way of describing them is by modifying ''djacu'' with other brivla, as in ''lo djacu poi barda''. <del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">--[[User:xorxes|xorxes]]</del></div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">** </ins>[[User:<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">And Rosta</ins>|<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">And Rosta</ins>]]<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">:</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">#</del>I agree that ''lu'o so'i'' means "many amounts together".</div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">*** </ins>I may be missing something here, but neither of these seem right. If each amount of water is small then <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>''lu'o so'i djacu<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>'' does not necessarily give you a lot of water: many waters do not necessarily amount to much water. And to me, <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>''pi so'i loi djacu<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'</ins>'' implies a large proportion of the mass of all water, whereas "much water" means "a quantity that is large relative to the quantity that is normal".</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">#</del>''so'e'' doesn't mean "a large proportion of"; it means "most", which, to oversimplify, means "more than half of". At any rate, we do want to distinguish between "a large amount of" and "a large proportion of", and I still feel that ''pi so'i'' is a better candidate for the latter.</div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">*** </ins>[[User:<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">xorxes</ins>|<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">xorxes:</ins>]]</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>**I guess it makes sense to separate the two meanings.</div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">**** </ins>I think they both mean "many amounts together". I don't think ''piso'i loi djacu'' is necessarily a large proportion of the mass of all water, because unlike ''so'a'' and ''so'e'', ''so'i'' doesn't refer to the total. Do many people make a lot of people? Only in that sense can we say that many waters make a lot of water. In any case it is subjective. Too much water would be ''pidu'e loi djacu'' or ''lu'o du'e djacu'', too many quantities of water together. All that ''djacu'' talks about is quantities of water, there is no way to describe those quantities with quantifiers, the only way of describing them is by modifying ''djacu'' with other brivla, as in ''lo djacu poi barda''.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">#</del>Many people do make a lot of people, because the unit for measuring quantity of people is the single person. But since the quantity that constitutes pa djacu is undefined, the single amount of water cannot be the unit for measuring quantity of water, so many amounts of water do not necessarily make a lot of water.</div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">***** </ins>I agree that ''lu'o so'i'' means "many amounts together".</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>**Not in an absolute sense, but in the context of those quantities, I think they do.</div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">***** </ins>''so'e'' doesn't mean "a large proportion of"; it means "most", which, to oversimplify, means "more than half of". At any rate, we do want to distinguish between "a large amount of" and "a large proportion of", and I still feel that ''pi so'i'' is a better candidate for the latter.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>**Okay, yes. In a context when we are measuring quantity be amounts of water, then yes, many amounts do equal much water. But basically I stand by what I said before.</div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">***</ins>** I guess it makes sense to separate the two meanings.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">#</del>I think ''pidu'e loi djacu'' means "too large a proportion of". I agree about the meaning of ''lu'o du'e djacu''.</div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">***** </ins>Many people do make a lot of people, because the unit for measuring quantity of people is the single person. But since the quantity that constitutes pa djacu is undefined, the single amount of water cannot be the unit for measuring quantity of water, so many amounts of water do not necessarily make a lot of water.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>**<del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">Ok.</del></div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">***</ins>** Not in an absolute sense, but in the context of those quantities, I think they do.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">#</del>You may be right that "a lot of water, much water" cannot adequately be rendered using quantifiers, but if this is the case it is important to know, because it is being suggested that ''PA [[va'e|va'e]]'' and ''JAhA xi PA'' could be used to render "very" (etc. -- see [[JAhA + CAI|JAhA + CAI]]), in which case the PA should be a word meaning "much". If there is no quantifier meaning "much", then none of those solutions are going to work.</div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">****</ins>** Okay, yes. In a context when we are measuring quantity be amounts of water, then yes, many amounts do equal much water. But basically I stand by what I said before.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>**If ''pirova'e'' means "totally", why can't the other fractions mean "very much", "a little", etc? <del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">--</del>[[User:<del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">xorxes</del>|<del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">xorxes</del>]]</div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">***** </ins>I think ''pidu'e loi djacu'' means "too large a proportion of". I agree about the meaning of ''lu'o du'e djacu''.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>**Because: (i) "totally" <del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">'''</del>is<del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">''' </del>a proportion: ''pi ro'' = "the whole of", ''pi so'i'' = "a large proportion of". (ii) Applied to the scale of truth, I'd see ''pi PA'' as expressing points on the doubly-bounded scale of Sort-of between True and False. So ''pi so'i va'e'' would mean something like "pretty truish, sort-of but close to being outright true".</div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>**<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">*** </ins>You may be right that "a lot of water, much water" cannot adequately be rendered using quantifiers, but if this is the case it is important to know, because it is being suggested that ''PA [[va'e|va'e]]'' and ''JAhA xi PA'' could be used to render "very" (etc. -- see [[JAhA + CAI|JAhA + CAI]]), in which case the PA should be a word meaning "much". If there is no quantifier meaning "much", then none of those solutions are going to work.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">--[[User:And Rosta|And Rosta]]</del></div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">***** [[User:xorxes|xorxes:]]</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-side-deleted"></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">****</ins>** If ''pirova'e'' means "totally", why can't the other fractions mean "very much", "a little", etc?</div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-side-deleted"></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">******* </ins>[[User:<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">And Rosta</ins>|<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">And Rosta:</ins>]]</div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-side-deleted"></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">******</ins>** Because: </div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-side-deleted"></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">********* </ins>(i) "totally" <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;"><u></ins>is<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;"></u> </ins>a proportion: ''pi ro'' = "the whole of", ''pi so'i'' = "a large proportion of". </div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-side-deleted"></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">********* </ins>(ii) Applied to the scale of truth, I'd see ''pi PA'' as expressing points on the doubly-bounded scale of Sort-of between True and False. So ''pi so'i va'e'' would mean something like "pretty truish, sort-of but close to being outright true".</div></td></tr>
<!-- diff cache key mediawiki:diff::1.12:old-91154:rev-106630 -->
</table>Glekihttps://mw-live.lojban.org/index.php?title=a_lot_of_water&diff=91154&oldid=prevGleki: Text replace - "jbocre: ([A-K])" to "$1"2014-03-23T14:54:41Z<p>Text replace - "jbocre: ([A-K])" to "$1"</p>
<table style="background-color: #fff; color: #202122;" data-mw="interface">
<col class="diff-marker" />
<col class="diff-content" />
<col class="diff-marker" />
<col class="diff-content" />
<tr class="diff-title" lang="en">
<td colspan="2" style="background-color: #fff; color: #202122; text-align: center;">← Older revision</td>
<td colspan="2" style="background-color: #fff; color: #202122; text-align: center;">Revision as of 14:54, 23 March 2014</td>
</tr><tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno" id="mw-diff-left-l18">Line 18:</td>
<td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno">Line 18:</td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>#I think ''pidu'e loi djacu'' means "too large a proportion of". I agree about the meaning of ''lu'o du'e djacu''.</div></td><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>#I think ''pidu'e loi djacu'' means "too large a proportion of". I agree about the meaning of ''lu'o du'e djacu''.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>**Ok.</div></td><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>**Ok.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>#You may be right that "a lot of water, much water" cannot adequately be rendered using quantifiers, but if this is the case it is important to know, because it is being suggested that ''PA [[va'e|va'e]]'' and ''JAhA xi PA'' could be used to render "very" (etc. -- see [[<del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">jbocre: </del>JAhA + CAI|JAhA + CAI]]), in which case the PA should be a word meaning "much". If there is no quantifier meaning "much", then none of those solutions are going to work.</div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>#You may be right that "a lot of water, much water" cannot adequately be rendered using quantifiers, but if this is the case it is important to know, because it is being suggested that ''PA [[va'e|va'e]]'' and ''JAhA xi PA'' could be used to render "very" (etc. -- see [[JAhA + CAI|JAhA + CAI]]), in which case the PA should be a word meaning "much". If there is no quantifier meaning "much", then none of those solutions are going to work.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>**If ''pirova'e'' means "totally", why can't the other fractions mean "very much", "a little", etc? --[[User:xorxes|xorxes]]</div></td><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>**If ''pirova'e'' means "totally", why can't the other fractions mean "very much", "a little", etc? --[[User:xorxes|xorxes]]</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>**Because: (i) "totally" '''is''' a proportion: ''pi ro'' = "the whole of", ''pi so'i'' = "a large proportion of". (ii) Applied to the scale of truth, I'd see ''pi PA'' as expressing points on the doubly-bounded scale of Sort-of between True and False. So ''pi so'i va'e'' would mean something like "pretty truish, sort-of but close to being outright true".</div></td><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>**Because: (i) "totally" '''is''' a proportion: ''pi ro'' = "the whole of", ''pi so'i'' = "a large proportion of". (ii) Applied to the scale of truth, I'd see ''pi PA'' as expressing points on the doubly-bounded scale of Sort-of between True and False. So ''pi so'i va'e'' would mean something like "pretty truish, sort-of but close to being outright true".</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>--[[User:And Rosta|And Rosta]]</div></td><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>--[[User:And Rosta|And Rosta]]</div></td></tr>
<!-- diff cache key mediawiki:diff::1.12:old-90808:rev-91154 -->
</table>Glekihttps://mw-live.lojban.org/index.php?title=a_lot_of_water&diff=90808&oldid=prevGleki: Text replace - "jbocre: ([a-z])" to "$1"2014-03-23T14:51:08Z<p>Text replace - "jbocre: ([a-z])" to "$1"</p>
<table style="background-color: #fff; color: #202122;" data-mw="interface">
<col class="diff-marker" />
<col class="diff-content" />
<col class="diff-marker" />
<col class="diff-content" />
<tr class="diff-title" lang="en">
<td colspan="2" style="background-color: #fff; color: #202122; text-align: center;">← Older revision</td>
<td colspan="2" style="background-color: #fff; color: #202122; text-align: center;">Revision as of 14:51, 23 March 2014</td>
</tr><tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno" id="mw-diff-left-l18">Line 18:</td>
<td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno">Line 18:</td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>#I think ''pidu'e loi djacu'' means "too large a proportion of". I agree about the meaning of ''lu'o du'e djacu''.</div></td><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>#I think ''pidu'e loi djacu'' means "too large a proportion of". I agree about the meaning of ''lu'o du'e djacu''.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>**Ok.</div></td><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>**Ok.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>#You may be right that "a lot of water, much water" cannot adequately be rendered using quantifiers, but if this is the case it is important to know, because it is being suggested that ''PA [[<del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">jbocre: </del>va'e|va'e]]'' and ''JAhA xi PA'' could be used to render "very" (etc. -- see [[jbocre: JAhA + CAI|JAhA + CAI]]), in which case the PA should be a word meaning "much". If there is no quantifier meaning "much", then none of those solutions are going to work.</div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>#You may be right that "a lot of water, much water" cannot adequately be rendered using quantifiers, but if this is the case it is important to know, because it is being suggested that ''PA [[va'e|va'e]]'' and ''JAhA xi PA'' could be used to render "very" (etc. -- see [[jbocre: JAhA + CAI|JAhA + CAI]]), in which case the PA should be a word meaning "much". If there is no quantifier meaning "much", then none of those solutions are going to work.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>**If ''pirova'e'' means "totally", why can't the other fractions mean "very much", "a little", etc? --[[User:xorxes|xorxes]]</div></td><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>**If ''pirova'e'' means "totally", why can't the other fractions mean "very much", "a little", etc? --[[User:xorxes|xorxes]]</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>**Because: (i) "totally" '''is''' a proportion: ''pi ro'' = "the whole of", ''pi so'i'' = "a large proportion of". (ii) Applied to the scale of truth, I'd see ''pi PA'' as expressing points on the doubly-bounded scale of Sort-of between True and False. So ''pi so'i va'e'' would mean something like "pretty truish, sort-of but close to being outright true".</div></td><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>**Because: (i) "totally" '''is''' a proportion: ''pi ro'' = "the whole of", ''pi so'i'' = "a large proportion of". (ii) Applied to the scale of truth, I'd see ''pi PA'' as expressing points on the doubly-bounded scale of Sort-of between True and False. So ''pi so'i va'e'' would mean something like "pretty truish, sort-of but close to being outright true".</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>--[[User:And Rosta|And Rosta]]</div></td><td class="diff-marker"></td><td style="background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>--[[User:And Rosta|And Rosta]]</div></td></tr>
<!-- diff cache key mediawiki:diff::1.12:old-86702:rev-90808 -->
</table>Glekihttps://mw-live.lojban.org/index.php?title=a_lot_of_water&diff=86702&oldid=prevGleki: Gleki moved page jbocre: a lot of water to a lot of water without leaving a redirect: Text replace - "jbocre: a" to "a"2014-03-23T11:35:11Z<p>Gleki moved page <a href="/index.php?title=jbocre:_a_lot_of_water&action=edit&redlink=1" class="new" title="jbocre: a lot of water (page does not exist)">jbocre: a lot of water</a> to <a href="/papri/a_lot_of_water" title="a lot of water">a lot of water</a> without leaving a redirect: Text replace - "jbocre: a" to "a"</p>
<table style="background-color: #fff; color: #202122;" data-mw="interface">
<col class="diff-marker" />
<col class="diff-content" />
<col class="diff-marker" />
<col class="diff-content" />
<tr class="diff-title" lang="en">
<td colspan="2" style="background-color: #fff; color: #202122; text-align: center;">← Older revision</td>
<td colspan="2" style="background-color: #fff; color: #202122; text-align: center;">Revision as of 11:35, 23 March 2014</td>
</tr>
<!-- diff cache key mediawiki:diff::1.12:old-74316:rev-86702 -->
</table>Glekihttps://mw-live.lojban.org/index.php?title=a_lot_of_water&diff=74316&oldid=prevGleki at 16:42, 4 November 20132013-11-04T16:42:54Z<p></p>
<table style="background-color: #fff; color: #202122;" data-mw="interface">
<col class="diff-marker" />
<col class="diff-content" />
<col class="diff-marker" />
<col class="diff-content" />
<tr class="diff-title" lang="en">
<td colspan="2" style="background-color: #fff; color: #202122; text-align: center;">← Older revision</td>
<td colspan="2" style="background-color: #fff; color: #202122; text-align: center;">Revision as of 16:42, 4 November 2013</td>
</tr><tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno" id="mw-diff-left-l1">Line 1:</td>
<td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno">Line 1:</td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>= [<del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">http</del>:<del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">//www</del>.<del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">lojban</del>.<del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">org/tiki/kreig</del>.<del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">daniyl</del>. <del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">Craig Daniel</del>] <del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">(la </del>.<del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">kreig</del>.<del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">daniyl</del>.<del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">) =</del></div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div> </div></td></tr>
<tr><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="−"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* <del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">Translation </del>of the '''[<del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">http</del>:<del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">//www</del>.<del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">lojban</del>.<del style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">org/tiki/Emerald+Tablets Emerald Tablets</del>]'''</div></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">{so'i prenu} = "many people"</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-side-deleted"></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">{pi so'i prenu} </ins>= <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">"a lot of a person"</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-side-deleted"></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">{so'i djacu} = "many amounts of water"</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-side-deleted"></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">{pi so'i djacu} = "a lot of an amount of water"</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-side-deleted"></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">??? = "a lot of water, too much water"</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-side-deleted"></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">--[</ins>[<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">User</ins>:<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">And Rosta|And Rosta]]</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-side-deleted"></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">----</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-side-deleted"></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">''lu'o so'i djacu'' or ''piso'i loi djacu'', they both have the same sense. --[[User:xorxes|xorxes]]</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-side-deleted"></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">I may be missing something here, but neither of these seem right. If each amount of water is small then ''lu'o so'i djacu'' does not necessarily give you a lot of water: many waters do not necessarily amount to much water. And to me, ''pi so'i loi djacu'' implies a large proportion of the mass of all water, whereas "much water" means "a quantity that is large relative to the quantity that is normal". --[[User:And Rosta|And Rosta]]</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-side-deleted"></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">I think they both mean "many amounts together". I don't think ''piso'i loi djacu'' is necessarily a large proportion of the mass of all water, because unlike ''so'a'' and ''so'e'', ''so'i'' doesn't refer to the total</ins>. <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">Do many people make a lot of people? Only in that sense can we say that many waters make a lot of water</ins>. <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">In any case it is subjective</ins>. <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">Too much water would be ''pidu'e loi djacu'' or ''lu'o du'e djacu'', too many quantities of water together</ins>. <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">All that ''djacu'' talks about is quantities of water, there is no way to describe those quantities with quantifiers, the only way of describing them is by modifying ''djacu'' with other brivla, as in ''lo djacu poi barda''. --[[User:xorxes|xorxes</ins>]<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">]</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-side-deleted"></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">#I agree that ''lu'o so'i'' means "many amounts together".</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-side-deleted"></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">#''so'e'' doesn't mean "a large proportion of"; it means "most", which, to oversimplify, means "more than half of". At any rate, we do want to distinguish between "a large amount of" and "a large proportion of", and I still feel that ''pi so'i'' is a better candidate for the latter.</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-side-deleted"></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">**I guess it makes sense to separate the two meanings.</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-side-deleted"></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">#Many people do make a lot of people, because the unit for measuring quantity of people is the single person. But since the quantity that constitutes pa djacu is undefined, the single amount of water cannot be the unit for measuring quantity of water, so many amounts of water do not necessarily make a lot of water.</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-side-deleted"></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">**Not in an absolute sense, but in the context of those quantities, I think they do.</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-side-deleted"></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">**Okay, yes. In a context when we are measuring quantity be amounts of water, then yes, many amounts do equal much water</ins>. <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">But basically I stand by what I said before</ins>.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-side-deleted"></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">#I think ''pidu'e loi djacu'' means "too large a proportion of". I agree about the meaning of ''lu'o du'e djacu''</ins>.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-side-deleted"></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>*<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">*Ok.</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-side-deleted"></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">#You may be right that "a lot </ins>of <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">water, much water" cannot adequately be rendered using quantifiers, but if this is </ins>the <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">case it is important to know, because it is being suggested that ''PA [[jbocre: va</ins>'<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">e|va</ins>'<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">e]]</ins>'<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">' and ''JAhA xi PA'' could be used to render "very" (etc. -- see [</ins>[<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">jbocre</ins>: <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">JAhA + CAI|JAhA + CAI]]), in which case the PA should be a word meaning "much"</ins>. <ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">If there is no quantifier meaning "much", then none of those solutions are going to work</ins>.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-side-deleted"></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">**If ''pirova'e'' means "totally", why can't the other fractions mean "very much", "a little", etc? --[[User:xorxes|xorxes]</ins>]</div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-side-deleted"></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">**Because: (i) "totally" </ins>'''<ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">is''' a proportion: ''pi ro'' = "the whole of", ''pi so'i'' = "a large proportion of". (ii) Applied to the scale of truth, I'd see ''pi PA'' as expressing points on the doubly-bounded scale of Sort-of between True and False. So ''pi so'i va'e'' would mean something like "pretty truish, sort-of but close to being outright true".</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-side-deleted"></td><td class="diff-marker" data-marker="+"></td><td style="color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">--[[User:And Rosta|And Rosta]]</ins></div></td></tr>
<!-- diff cache key mediawiki:diff::1.12:old-63811:rev-74316 -->
</table>Glekihttps://mw-live.lojban.org/index.php?title=a_lot_of_water&diff=63811&oldid=prevVruxir at 16:42, 4 November 20132013-11-04T16:42:07Z<p></p>
<p><b>New page</b></p><div>= [http://www.lojban.org/tiki/kreig.daniyl. Craig Daniel] (la .kreig.daniyl.) =<br />
* Translation of the '''[http://www.lojban.org/tiki/Emerald+Tablets Emerald Tablets]'''</div>Vruxir